Trading Tuxemon

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By Sanglorian 1 May 2017 10:45

Champion · 420 comments

I had an idea late last night: what if instead of having set people who would offer set trades, you could trade with any Trainer you have already defeated in battle? You could offer any tuxemon in your collection, for any tuxemon in their team, and they'd either accept or reject you. Maybe they'd become insulted with low offers, and their expectations for a trade would become higher. This could be the only way to acquire some tuxemon.

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By xirsoi 2 May 2017 02:02

Champion · 62 comments

OR, we could have an npc disposition system! You gotta make'em like you!

Actually, that adds like seven new levels of complexity, so maybe not tongue


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By tamashihoshi 3 May 2017 22:09

Champion · 242 comments

@Lori:
Sounds similar to how trading and communication and stuff works in older strategy/colonization games, where you can form alliances by making other nation-leaders like you... (especially the "they'd become insulted with low offers" ^^)

@Xirsoi:
Disposition system? I'm not sure if I understand it right.. like in some kind of rpg with "light dating sim" elements?

---

I think I like a deeper tuxemon-trade NPC relationship.. but it shouldn't be generally like this. Some NPCs should still be simple, like "I really want a rockkitten, I'd give my tumblecoon for it!" or probably "(...) I'd give my tumblecoon or komodraw for it!" (so you can choose which one you want)
Also, how about trading a Tuxemon for an object or for a favor? Should be special objects and special favors of course big_smile

How does trading exactly work? IF (it's not really clear right now) the Tuxemon are bound onto objects, do they unbound them and then .. like... trade the Tuxemon "soul"? Or do they trade the object? Or do we have tuxeballs?


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By xirsoi 4 May 2017 10:09

Champion · 62 comments

I mean like in Morrowind or Crusader Kings 2. The character's would like or dislike you (on a scale of 0 to 100 in MW, -100 to 100 in CK2) based on traits, actions, and dialogue choices. Such a system would be cool, but unnecessarily complex for a game of this nature. WAY beyond scope.


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By tamashihoshi 4 May 2017 11:22

Champion · 242 comments
xirsoi wrote

I mean like in Morrowind or Crusader Kings 2. The character's would like or dislike you (on a scale of 0 to 100 in MW, -100 to 100 in CK2) based on traits, actions, and dialogue choices. Such a system would be cool, but unnecessarily complex for a game of this nature. WAY beyond scope.

I don't think its that complex... basically you'd add a new variable for "affected" npcs. In Tiled you can write the dialogue etc... and if you do certain stuff, you raise/lower that variable. As long as this feature doesn't have an impact on the story (different routes to go when a certain NPC likes/dislikes you) it should be fine.


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By Sanglorian 4 May 2017 13:17

Champion · 420 comments
tamashihoshi wrote

I think I like a deeper tuxemon-trade NPC relationship.. but it shouldn't be generally like this. Some NPCs should still be simple, like "I really want a rockkitten, I'd give my tumblecoon for it!" or probably "(...) I'd give my tumblecoon or komodraw for it!" (so you can choose which one you want)
Also, how about trading a Tuxemon for an object or for a favor? Should be special objects and special favors of course big_smile

I think if we did implement a system like this, it should apply to all trainers. Part of the appeal would be that any time you faced a creature in battle, you would know that you could acquire that creature in the future through a trade. Otherwise, I think having just the simple trades would be better.

What sort of objects and favours do you have in mind for trading?

How does trading exactly work? IF (it's not really clear right now) the Tuxemon are bound onto objects, do they unbound them and then .. like... trade the Tuxemon "soul"? Or do they trade the object? Or do we have tuxeballs?

I don't think this has been set in stone, but I don't think it would affect the mechanics of the game. Of course it would affect how the trading scene was animated, and possibly how people talked about trading. Is that why you were asking? I'd say do whatever is easiest to animate.

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By tamashihoshi 4 May 2017 21:55

Champion · 242 comments
Sanglorian wrote

I think if we did implement a system like this, it should apply to all trainers. Part of the appeal would be that any time you faced a creature in battle, you would know that you could acquire that creature in the future through a trade. Otherwise, I think having just the simple trades would be better.

What sort of objects and favours do you have in mind for trading?

About all trainers: Yeah you're right, here is my nod: -nods-

About objects and favours:
Let me make a few examples (which I make up right now):
A woman tells you about her husband, who went on a journey but didn't return (such a classic!). The Tuxemon of her husband is staying with her. You find out about her husband and tell her that he will not return. She is sad but at the same time glad to finally have a clear answer. The husbands Tuxemon usually went with the man to the journeys, but since he disappeared, the tuxemon just stays home. It's unhappy to loose the man and to stay lonely at home. So the woman let's the tuxemon join you, so it is able to see the world again instead of being boung onto a small place with her.
Probably the trainer could choose to let the tuxemon join you or not...
Something similar can be made with items as well.
Another example could be: You bring some items to a person and that person takes like... 4 of the 5 balls and gives you the last as thanks. Later you find out that the 5th stone has a tuxemon kept in it (if we have the soul-bound system). So you just got a Tuxemon for a quest.
This isn't really trading tuxemon with tuxemon. The first one is Tuxemon for an answer, the second one Tuxemon for some special balls.
Probably trading isn't the right word but tuxemon as a reward for (side)quests.

Sanglorian wrote

I don't think this has been set in stone, but I don't think it would affect the mechanics of the game. Of course it would affect how the trading scene was animated, and possibly how people talked about trading. Is that why you were asking? I'd say do whatever is easiest to animate.

Yeah... kinda. But I don't really remember what thought I had >_<'
I like to animate ANYTHING so it doesn't really matter to me big_smile


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By xirsoi 4 May 2017 22:12

Champion · 62 comments

Those sound like quests with rewards tamashi smile


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By tamashihoshi 5 May 2017 08:28

Champion · 242 comments

you're right hahaha xD


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By bitcraft 9 May 2017 04:54

Champion · 127 comments
xirsoi wrote

OR, we could have an npc disposition system! You gotta make'em like you!

I do like this idea, but that moves Tuxemon into Harvest Moon territory (...being somewhat between Pokemon and Morrowwind).  I'm not sure if the gameplay would really accommodate that right now, but it is an idea worth holding on to, if the game becomes more complex and adds a social element (so far, I haven't seen many (any?) comments about implementing a social reputation system).

In general, as a developer, I think the best way forward (for me!) would be to implement quests and rewards first.  That would satisfy "hey you brought me a flower, have a DANDYLION in return ?"  Its worth noting, quests can be implemented right now using Map Actions and Conditions...."Quests" would be an easier set of Map Actions, imo.

Beyond that, following the simple nature of the Pokemon games, perhaps trading could be implemented with a store-like interface, initiated by a dialog.  They could either say "Sure, what do you have?", or "Buzz off loser!!!!" (depends on their personality?  unlocked by a quest?).  Mix it up a bit.  Tuxemon could have a secret value (their "worth") assigned to them, so other trainers would reject unfair trades (won't accept a lvl 1 TUX for a lvl 10 SUMOBUG).

Just thoughts.

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By Sanglorian 9 May 2017 07:16

Champion · 420 comments

Here's a simple system I brainstormed.

When you turn your Trading App on and talk to a trainer you have already defeated in battle, an interface pops up with your tuxemon team of 6 on one side and their team on the other, listing name, variety and level. You can select one of your tuxemon and one of theirs, then click "Suggest Trade".

The game then calculates each tuxemon's "Value". That is their level * their rarity, which would be between 0.5 and 2 depending on what type of tuxemon they are.

Then the other trainer's, but not your, tuxemon are multiplied by 1.25, to reflect that trainer's emotional attachment to them.

This number is secret. When you propose a trade, the Value of your tuxemon is compared to the Value of their tuxemon. If your tuxemon's Value is equal to or higher than theirs, the trade occurs and now you each have the other's tuxemon.

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By bitcraft 9 May 2017 17:41

Champion · 127 comments
Sandlorian wrote

The game then calculates each tuxemon's "Value". That is their level * their rarity, which would be between 0.5 and 2 depending on what type of tuxemon they are.  Then the other trainer's, but not your, tuxemon are multiplied by 1.25, to reflect that trainer's emotional attachment to them.

The secret value is pretty much how I envision it as well.  The emotional attachment value could use some adjustment for favorite monsters....Ash Ketchum may never want to trade away his pikachu, no matter the value of the other monster.  Maybe the value could be based on the monster order?  Since trainers tend to share identity with their monsters, maybe their #1 should have a 2x or 3x emotional value modifier?  Other monsters on their list would be less....they would care less if they are traded.  Just a thought.

What is the "Trading App"?

In general though, I think your interface ideas work well enough.  The only snag that I can see is how to deal with monster storage.  Can you trade a monster that is in storage?  In that case, your side would show many monsters, and the other side would show just their party of 6.

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By Sanglorian 11 May 2017 12:25

Champion · 420 comments
bitcraft wrote
Sandlorian wrote

The game then calculates each tuxemon's "Value". That is their level * their rarity, which would be between 0.5 and 2 depending on what type of tuxemon they are.  Then the other trainer's, but not your, tuxemon are multiplied by 1.25, to reflect that trainer's emotional attachment to them.

The secret value is pretty much how I envision it as well.  The emotional attachment value could use some adjustment for favorite monsters....Ash Ketchum may never want to trade away his pikachu, no matter the value of the other monster.  Maybe the value could be based on the monster order?  Since trainers tend to share identity with their monsters, maybe their #1 should have a 2x or 3x emotional value modifier?  Other monsters on their list would be less....they would care less if they are traded.  Just a thought.

That sounds good!

What is the "Trading App"?

I think you'd just toggle it from the menu, and then when you spoke to people, the trading screen would come up instead of their standard dialogue.

In general though, I think your interface ideas work well enough.  The only snag that I can see is how to deal with monster storage.  Can you trade a monster that is in storage?  In that case, your side would show many monsters, and the other side would show just their party of 6.

I would say no. Conceptually, you don't have access to the rest of your tuxemon while you're out and about, so why would you for trades? But I could be persuaded otherwise.

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By tamashihoshi 12 May 2017 17:57

Champion · 242 comments
Sanglorian wrote

I would say no. Conceptually, you don't have access to the rest of your tuxemon while you're out and about, so why would you for trades? But I could be persuaded otherwise.

What about this?
https://forum.tuxemon.org/thread.php?id=89

Edit: To be more precise, I'm talking about the drone idea smile

Last edited by tamashihoshi (12 May 2017 17:57)


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By Sanglorian 13 May 2017 01:05

Champion · 420 comments
tamashihoshi wrote
Sanglorian wrote

I would say no. Conceptually, you don't have access to the rest of your tuxemon while you're out and about, so why would you for trades? But I could be persuaded otherwise.

What about this?
https://forum.tuxemon.org/thread.php?id=89

Edit: To be more precise, I'm talking about the drone idea smile

Hmm, but even then you could just use the drone to add something to your party of six, then still trade with the six you have. As for whether the drone idea is a good one, I think it would require a discussion about how it would affect the game. Being able to access all your tuxemon at any time means you can design any team in preparation for any battle, you have effectively limitless healing, etc. That would have a big impact on the game.

Inspired by bitcraft's idea, I did suggest a one-use item though that would allow swapping out one tuxemon for one other: https://wiki.tuxemon.org/index.php?title=Drone

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By bitcraft 16 May 2017 19:13

Champion · 127 comments

The one use drone seems more balanced and fair than always available.